Becky Fox on Why Purpose-Led Businesses Need Communities
Episode Details
Transcript
Becky Fox is the founder of the susMBA, a sustainable business mentor and a born community builder. She first learned about the power of community growing up in a community centre and went on to put what she'd learned into practice by building a surfing business with no money in her early 20s. She's gone on to work with a number of businesses in the sustainability space since then and what has united the successful ones has been the strength of the communities they lean on. In this episode we talk about:
- How Becky built her first purpose-led business with no money;
- Community and brand building;
- Going to business school and founding the susMBA;
- Common practices of purpose-led businesses;
- Why we need 'nudges' for mass adoption of sustainable practices;
- What the future of business looks like.
More reading on how B Corps are better able to weather economic storms:
- Forbes: Why Purpose-Driven Businesses are Faring Better in Covid 19
- B The Change. Christopher Marquis:B Corps Are Leading the Shift to Stakeholder Capitalism
Want delicious, beautifully packaged tea that makes an impact? Check out our season partner Tea Bird Tea. You can get 20% off your purchase with the code HUGINAMUG20.
Follow The Purpose Effect on Instagram, or send us an email at hello@thepurposeeffectpod.com we'd love hearing from you!
Speaker 1
00:00
One of the biggest issues we face is this concept called the attitude Behavior Gap and it's caused by something called the social desirability biased. So, what we end up doing, is we over exaggerate our attitudes towards Concepts that we think will make us seem more socially desirable. So for example, sustainability will also will all talk. The talk saying that we care, we care but our general Behavior speak. A lot differently. The after shift towards Behavior will either be slow because it's just the natural way. That things happen or we need to start having nudges. Welcome back to the purpose, affect the podcast about purpose-driven businesses, and what we can learn about solving some of the world's biggest problems from the woman who are solving them, I am Elena Kersey, and I am on a mission to learn how we can, build better work, stronger communities. A healthier Planet if you believe there's a better world out there waiting for us, then this podcast is for you.
Speaker 2
01:08
In her early 20s, Becky Fox built her first purpose LED business with no money together. With her husband, Becky started a business, providing surf camps for children and in the process, taught them how to be leaders, how to be environmental stewards, and how to give back to their own communities. She did this by leaning into her own community, and they leaned right back so much so that she managed to get her first batch of equipment with what was essentially a credit note. And in the years since Becky has worked with studied and consulted for sustainable businesses, she's also launched her own sustainable Business course. This us MBA and what she's learned is that strong communities are. What makes sustainable businesses thrive? If you are building a sustainable business or you're thinking of making a career change to do, so then you will want to listen to what Becky has to say not just about community building but about how we can get all businesses to commit to and deliver on purpose Beyond profit. So let us get to the conversation with Becky, Fox founder of sus, MBA and sustainable business Mentor. But before we do, I am going to pour myself a hug in a mug with a cup of tea red tea. I love T-bird tea and not just because the packaging is absolutely beautiful. Although it is or because the tea is organic and comes in biodegradable, tea bags, although it does but because I love the way T-bird T's Founder Ashley cultural uses her business to support other businesses doing, good. Ashley partners with Brands and not-for-profits, doing good for people and Planet because she believes that, this is how you build sustainable businesses and I couldn't agree more. So if you want delicious healthy beautifully, packaged T that makes impact you can get 20% off using the code hug and a mug. 20, I would recommend the earl grey and orange. It's my favorite. I was curious to learn how this Community First approach to business building came. So naturally to Becky and it turns out community building is in her blood. She grew up in a community center, just outside of London where the ethos was all about mucking in.
Speaker 1
03:29
So, I didn't think my upbringing was strange, I guess until I became an adult and then reflected back on it. So I my early years were spent in this community center, that my dad ran dad went there as a kid. My Mum went there as a kid, my grandparents went there. So it's like so it's this real sort of backlog of family and friends. It was initially set up after WWII. I think to just unite the Germans and the British back together, it was this beautiful campus very interesting. Yeah. So it was set up by initially it was like a Christian background that was set up outside of London to just unite and bring people together and just over the years expanded and so my dad was the warden and here. Nets are all through my sort of five, six, seven, just grew up in this environment. You'd have big camps of people coming down over the summer season. So you're kind of be encouraged by tons of other people and other kids. And it was just a big adventure and then in the offseason, there would be school groups. Come through, maybe corporate groups, maybe Buddhist Meditation, Retreats just a real mix of people. And a lot of volunteers from a lot of countries. You know. No ego, no jobs. And it's funny actually because see Since I have always been searching for communities as an adult, and I have paid to go to places where again, there's very similar Vibes of you go and you help out and everyone gets stuck in and it's almost like the sort of meditative, you know, some of these yoga retreats and places integrate these policies of everybody just doing things in this very collaborative way. And then also, I went after that my dad went on to work in youth hostels. So this was for young men, Women who may be a come off the street, or had come out of jail or her just being, you know, down on luck in life and needed somewhere. So, that was a very different type of community, but still again around, a lot of people and I think that gave showed me that it doesn't matter about someone's situation or where they're from, you know, when you meet them and you meet them, where they're at, on a personal level, the majority of the time people are really nice, and they're just trying to get by in life so it really helps. To remove a lot of prejudgments as you.
Speaker 2
05:45
Age. Yeah. As you were talking about this ethos of everyone getting stuck in, it makes me think about a common trait that I have observed in a lot of entrepreneurs particularly entrepreneurs who like you started really young. And that is this very action-oriented mindset and a mindset which is about just start. I wonder how your journey into entrepreneurship began and whether any of that resonates with you whether you have kind of always.
Speaker 1
06:21
Been somebody who's willing to just start and just muck in. Yeah. I hadn't thought about it like that before us a good question. I think definitely growing up around so many other adults doing things as a child then you see that actually are you can you might have maybe larger Ambitions or that they're doing stuff so you want to do it. To whereas most children just, you know, you grow up in schools around your peers and other people aren't doing things. So I think, Definitely, Maybe that did push me on my comfort zone a bit when I was younger. So I took that on as an adult, the first business that I opened was very much, just almost an accident and it was that just approach of like. Okay, let us just start and just see where this goes.
Speaker 2
07:01
So, let us talk about that first business. That was surf Hong Kong. I believe, right? What was the mission behind that?
Speaker 1
07:10
So the way we started it, I made my husband we were about been in our early 20s about 21, 22 would just come out of studying, and we initially just started because we wanted to just have a bit inverter Venture, and we started just teaching surfing and so it started really small but very quickly we realized that there was much bigger demand people wanted summer camps, and they didn't just want surfing, and they want to send their kids off with us, and they wanted hiking and climbing and all these other things, and then we Realize actually schools were really where it was at and big school, groups have 50, kids and things. So, the purpose of it, just grew very, very, very quickly, but we always wanted to really connect with the community and have a lot of meaning to what we were doing. So I think it was a means to an ends to have these people flowing through, it was profitable. But also then to be able to Like these bigger impacts that gave me. And my husband, a lot of joy to be able to like, give back through some of the camps in the special needs programs. And Community things that we ran that it was a quite an organic process. So, how did that work? How.
Speaker 2
08:26
Did the business give back to some of these communities? Do you have like a specific example of how you would integrate those?
Speaker 1
08:34
Programs? Yeah, yeah. So other than, you know, just the normal things like beach, cleanups and education events and things. We ran. We Called a surf and serve. So we would work with the schools they would. The schools would also need to have programs in place where the kids gave back. So we partnered with them to be able to do that. So we would have kids from international schools that are pretty privileged paying quite a lot of money to come on a week-long camp with us, and we decided what we would do is we would teach these kids, the skills to become surf instructors almost by the end of the week. Teach them how to serve, teach them how to teach surfing? And then at the end of the week we were The school in full of refugee and migrant kids that couldn't afford to come on the cam. And instead of us teaching them, we would then empower the students from these international schools to be able to teach these kids. And it was just that was the one of the best Camp server because every child got so much out of it, and we were able to have a much bigger impact and bring this school on. That necessarily wouldn't be able to come and have a, you know, some of them haven't even been to the beach before. So it was just.
Speaker 2
09:41
That was something that we would do. Do also very interesting from a leadership development perspective, right? Because you're helping these young children, develop leadership skills in a really tangible way, at a very, very young age. And then also through that embodying, this idea of service and how important I believe service is to leadership. And I don't think that's something that even now, a lot of leadership training programs talked about enough. But I think also, it's interesting to look at this business not just from a social impact perspective but the financial impact this became a big business, a million dollar business and you built it by the age of 25. So I mean, I imagine that was crazy for you. Like, how did you manage that? How did you manage the scale? So young, probably with not much business experience and how did you continue? Tin you to grow.
Speaker 1
10:43
That. Yeah, it's funny. We me and my husband have been reflecting upon it and I think age played in our favor then because we didn't know, we didn't know if we were running a successful business because we have nothing to compare it to, we were just running a business and it's only now in our 30s. Having really worked with a lot of other people that we reflect upon it and think. Oh, we did have a really good business and it ran really well. And it's sort of, it's really funny. So at the time we just, we just didn't really Are we focused on putting a lot of money? Reinvesting it back into the company. So the cash flow was great, the profitability in the margins were great. But everything can those first four years, just went back into personal, like, upskilling reinvesting, building improving. And so it's not like we ever took out large chunks of money and thought, Oh my God, look at all this. If I now got to that stage again, I think it would be a lot more intimidating because I think I would it's like, dunning-kruger effect. Where you don't know what you don't know and you think you're an expert and whereas now I know quite a bit more, I would definitely apply different strategies of and a different approach to it. Yeah. What would you do differently? Now, if you were to do it again, I think I would probably celebrate those wins a little bit more because we, again, we just didn't know, but the fact that we instantly started turning a profit, I mean, that's a huge success in a business for the first year. So I would definitely celebrate those things. A lot more and then, really lean into what's working.
Speaker 2
12:16
So the fact that you turned a profit in the first year, that is very difficult for most businesses. Let alone Mission driven businesses, right? So was it just you know the right time really great product Market fit at a time when there wasn't a lot of competition like was it these sort of this macro environment that really supported you or was there something else that you did that? Maybe we can all learn from and take into our own businesses.
Speaker 1
12:44
But a small profit turn. The Profit but a small profit in that first year. So that's definitely something to remember. Yeah, look I think we need, I think any successful business and any successful entrepreneur, really has to acknowledge luck. I mean, if we had built this business and started it in 2019, this wouldn't be the same story. I wouldn't be talking about it because covid-19 it would have got shut down. So we were so lucky with the timing of when we opened. So very fortunate for that, and We will also again because we didn't know much about business. Initially you really want to make sure you have got Market validation before you dive into deep, and we did that again, without really knowing it. We ended up pre-selling the first courses before we really had any equipment. So that brought in the funds to be able to really go and purchase the assets that we need it because, you know, except for words and things are quite large. But again, just that luck of those things that we did. And the luck that the market was there so it wasn't we didn't have to really do the Hard Sell. And that's the dream business, right? Where, yeah, you don't have to do the Hard Sell because we weren't hard selling me. And my husband just focus more around community and actually as you build a business that's really what you want to be doing, but we just did it just you know, by accident. So we really focused on just having our doors open. We were this face of the company. Anyone was Come and through that we just networked with these amazing people that would then send us their school camps, you know, like the teachers would come down. And so what we were doing was strategically what you meant to do when you build a brand and build a business, but we were just sort of stumbling along doing it by accident. But now I would definitely take all of those strategies and still apply them to any business that I would be doing. Now.
Speaker 2
14:40
This Community First approach in brand building has now become it's a strategy See that lots of people are adopting really well like Lululemon. For example, that's core to their strategy right when they enter a market. It's all about Community Building first but for you, it came naturally and I wonder if that was because you are a community builder at heart, but okay. Now I have to write rewind a little bit and.
Speaker 1
15:08
Go deeper here because I want to.
Speaker 2
15:11
I want to understand you pre-sold, your first course without Having any equipment, having a brand necessarily? How did you do that? Did you rock up to schools and knock on?
Speaker 1
15:23
Doors? The great thing about that is when we were so young really just pushed us into things that, you know, we wouldn't have done. So one of the biggest mistakes, we probably would have done. If we were starting this business at their age as we probably would have, maybe tried to take a loan try to borrow money from maybe see if we had any savings to buy all these things. And then we would have probably tried to run.
Speaker 2
15:45
Camps.
Speaker 1
15:46
But this way around will happen was we just pretty much just made a brochure with some stock images? I think we had maybe one or two surfboards, and we had a few kids come down from the local Village took a few photos put together a little brochure and then these schools are always looking for camps or summer camps or things that they can follow their kids into. There's a lot of, in Hong Kong need for extracurricular, especially in the holidays. People of both parents are usually working so that was quite an easy one to go for. So again, we just pitched that this would be the camp. And this particular School locked in for about 20 kids for a week-long camp, and then paid the deposit up front, and we even actually one of the stores where we were buying, a lot of the equipment because we needed tents, you know, we needed sleeping bags. We needed is a lot of stuff. So I think we, I don't think we even got the initial money to offset the pay. We went to one of the Doors and got like a credit loan of okay, these guys are about to pay the camp is about to run, give us all the equipment. We need, will come back and pay. So it was this very like, it's quite high risk, but at that startup stage, sometimes you need that little bit of a risk of pre selling something and then delivering on it, to get it rolling.
Speaker 2
17:07
You also had to get the store to agree to that. Like, why would they agree to do that? For two young 25 year olds who are like, hey can we have a bunch of your equipment? Meant for, you know, just a deposit because, welcome through.
Speaker 1
17:20
I think that's why I like the community building comes in as well, because everything that we did the place where we operated. We, I mean, in Hong Kong as well, you know, the local languages Cantonese. It's culturally very different being a koala Westerner there, but we really took it upon ourselves. My husband was born there. So, just really trying to make sure we formed a really strong connections with the local community, not just the expat community, so that you could lead Lean on them on times like that. Yeah I mean there was even one time when the village that we operated eggs were inside a country Park, the local villagers that lived in that area, got really annoyed with the government for taking away, some of their land. And so, they barricade it, the village, but obviously, we operate inside the village, but because we built this community and this relationship with this, they opened the doors to us, but they wouldn't let anybody else through. So nobody else from the public. So, So those types of things I think are really important. Yeah, I think that's, that is really important. It's so important to bring all of your stakeholders on side from the very beginning. So the learnings that you took from this first business experience, which was a mega success, not only in financial terms, but also just in terms of creating a model that's really interesting and sustainable and can be replicated.
Speaker 2
18:43
What did you sort of pile, A, these learnings into? What did you do next?
Speaker 1
18:47
Yes, sir. Because we didn't know that we were running this successful business, my husband and I thought, right? That's it. We have done, we didn't want to stay in Hong Kong. We had this big problem where we stumbled across building this business. We'd been there for about four to five years, but we didn't want to stay in Hong Kong. We were trying to do something else and be somewhere else. So we thought well we will go work for big successful businesses, so we can see how they operate now. We have done this. Small little thing that was really rough around the edges. The actually in hindsight, we realized was really good. We wanted to go and learn from the best. So we went and worked for um, some other Eco Retreats and like Hospitality around Philippines my husband's in Sri Lanka for a bit, and then we landed up at the Four Seasons in the Maldives. So really, that's, you know, that experience was just incredible. That really was seeing how the best operate and not. Just as a business. But again I guess this keeps going back to the community theme, which is quite funny because I didn't expect it but the way the Four Seasons operates as a community the way it treats, its guess for the way it treats its internal staff and then the things that can deliver on because of the community, it creates was just inspiring. So that was just one of the best companies to go. Learn from.
Speaker 2
20:07
So when you are working with these businesses where you also look at how these really much bigger businesses Incorporated purpose into their business.
Speaker 1
20:19
Models. Yeah, I think I mean 10 years ago it was a it's a hard thing because it wasn't a massive. Buzzword people were starting to do environmental things but the social and the impact the purpose Beyond profit B Corp. All those catch phrases were very much I think In the background just slowly starting to come up. Definitely. I was always interested in that but it wasn't very evident what people didn't really talk about it or publicize. It wasn't a massive selling point I think.
Speaker 2
20:49
Yeah. Like then but I think also the fact that it's a selling point, there's a little bit of a discomfort that I feel around that, right because to what extent is that purpose, washing and to what extent is that the Mandate of all business, which is what I believe, you know, the system we live in. Doesn't work for so many people. The players with a lot of power, our businesses and the ones who are Nimble enough to be able to make change by the private sector. And I really feel that it's the obligation of all businesses to be making a positive impact somehow. And I guess this really feeds into the work you have been doing with this us MBA and the coaching programs that you create for business owners. All As of entrepreneurs on how they can create businesses, which have a purpose Beyond profit. So, tell me a little bit about the sus MBA and what the goals behind that were? Yeah, so I started, I mean, so after all of this adventure, I went back to business school and did my Master's. I started doing sustainable development but moved into sustainable business, the business school. So it just had that mix of entrepreneurial and corporate sustainability. And then started mentoring.
Speaker 1
22:06
I realize that a lot of people had very similar problems and there was a lot more demand for people who wanted to know. Yeah. How do I have a better a bigger impact? Because I think not just is it amazing for the world but it's so meaningful for you as a person to be able to do that in your business and if you're just chasing profit at a very it can be a very sad journey and disheartening Journey because maybe they come, maybe they don't come whereas if you have this bigger impact at the end of it. So I just thought how could I Have a, how could I have a bigger impact? Well, if I had larger groups of people come through the program, then that would be great. And for me personally, then if that is a profitable model for myself, I can then offset and subsidize all the kind of volunteering fun stuff that I want to be doing that. I wouldn't be able to do. So of tomorrow, for example, I am going into work with the female refugees that here in Dunedin. And I am running a workshop for them on entrepreneurship, so to try and Empower them to think about how they can start, to have a bit of meaning to their lives here and how they can contribute to the local economy and just get more involved. So that's sort of the purpose as to why I started it.
Speaker 2
23:25
And when you look at purpose LED businesses, both maybe through your cohorts, in this us.
Speaker 1
23:32
MBA but as well.
Speaker 2
23:33
Through the work that you have done in the private sector previously. I they're sort of business fundamentals, that you always see with purpose-driven businesses that maybe you don't see across the board. Are there some business models that are better suited to creating a really strong purpose Beyond The Profit?
Speaker 1
23:55
I don't think there's any particular business model, you could be a service-based, you could be profit-based, it's just going to be very, very different. And I think some businesses, I mean any business there has to be the pursuit of profit to some extent because if you're not financially sustainable you're not in business and you move more towards maybe like an NGO or a charity or something. That may be real quiet relies on funding or you're going to be a very, very struggling business. And I see this a lot with sustainable startups or, you know, eco-friendly startups that they don't get that fundamental first, and then they don't actually last very long, the business will eventually sort of crumble, but then the other things that you can do the social, the environmental, the governance that the ethical operating, but that can just be applied to, to any, to any business model, the thing that you're trying, And to do good inherently, be good, which is the ideal scenario. But if you are a business that operates for necessity, so one of the first be cops in New Zealand was a medical plastic glove company. So you think, okay we're plastic gloves it's not exactly out to help the world, but they are a necessity. They were for medical equipment. You know, we do need them, so they're not creating a product that's impacting the world for the greater good, but then they're going to look at, okay? Well then How can we mitigate the externalities the negative things that we're having and how can we also add more through different social and environmental causes that we can pursue? So what I always suggest the companies that are looking to either, just set it up for the first time, what do you find passionate? What are you want to have an impact on? And again you're not going to be able to do everything it's just so hard. So you could look at something like the sdgs and pick one particular. Thing that you're passionate about, then I would look at what are your stakeholders find important? You know, what are they passionate about? What are they care about? So, again, maybe you're using something like the sdgs or using a framework, like the court to look at the particular things and go. Okay, well, we will start there. And then, the third thing is looking at policy and legal and changes in governance, that might affect your business in the future. So maybe there's actually some carbon reporting policies that are coming. Yup that you need to integrate and so then you have got three areas that you can focus on for your impact. Some of it might be Corporate social responsibility more CSR. Some of it might be more environmental but it's a good place to start and you can always go and do more but those three things. Yeah. I think we have all seen a lot of data that businesses that are been corpse are in some cases more resilient than others to economic turbulence businesses. That would be corpse in the last recession, whether those storms better. So, I wonder if there's anything you have seen either through some of the businesses you have worked on, or some of the businesses that you're helping launch things in place, which make you think that they're going to be.
Speaker 2
27:13
More resilient.
Speaker 1
27:15
Yeah, so I did my research thesis actually on be cupped. So I went out and surveyed and interviewed about 250 of them in the end from around the globe and one of the biggest things that came out of it was the community that they form together to be able to support each other. So the B2B was really strong and it was a.
Speaker 2
27:39
Community within the be Court.
Speaker 1
27:40
Network. Be cop to be cocked. So I Creates a community that they can Network and lead on. And again, when times get tough, that's just so valuable, you know, hey, I need this product but at a lower price because my Supply chains happened or Cove is happened, or can you follow me this thing or that thing? So that's really valuable. And then the other big thing that came out of the research was the talent retention and Recruitment. And for New Zealand, that's a massive problem. So when times get tough down here, the first thing that happens is this Talent shortage and then everyone gets fired, and then they try to rehire There's no scale. So if you can really hold on to your people during those times, you know, the pandemic that was really tricky. So a lot of companies here that operate in that kind of ethical way managed to keep a lot of that team because they put systems in place that really prioritize the people over the business at that time. So that when the pandemic finished, they really hit the ground running.
Speaker 2
28:38
There's this growing recognition that Purpose Driven business is actually performed really well. Well, all of the benchmarks that be caught certified businesses need to meet our benchmarks that helped create sort of robustness and, and sustainability and a business more generally. But we don't really have, I think the economic models in place to support this, our economic systems privilege, fast growth. So I am wondering what we can do whether it's education or whether it's More Partnerships between businesses business communities. What we can do to move the needle, a little bit on that mass adoption, because I feel sometimes like impact businesses live in this little Echo chamber, where we're preaching to the converted. So, what's how do we move the needle a little bit more?
Speaker 1
29:30
Yeah, it's a tricky one. So I love I would love to be able to say, you know, that being sustainable like really cells and that we're all just going to automatically move that way. But I like to think of About, you know, the plastic bags, and the supermarkets. It really wasn't until they were banded. That we really saw, a big shift towards bringing your own bag, or using paper. So there's one of the biggest issues we face is this concept called the attitude Behavior Gap and it's caused by something called the social desirability biased. So, what we end up doing, is we over exaggerate our attitudes towards its concept that we think will make us seem more socially desirable. So for example, sustainability will also will all talk. The talk saying that we care, we care but our general Behavior speak a lot differently so that all comes down to behavioral change cycles and behavioral change Cycles are slow, so it is nice. That our attitudes are starting to change but the actual shift towards Behavior will either be slow because it's just the natural way. That things happen or We need to start having nudges. So, for example, banning plastic bags and that's where I think governments are really responsible for intervening. And if you look at, you know, the old style capitalism and Milton Friedman's, books, and things there is always the emphasis that markets, cannot determine everything can at some point, governments will need to intervene to protect these externalities and I would love it. If businesses were just ethically do the right thing, you know? And that would be the dream and People think that should just be the way but it hasn't really played out like that. Like will always try and take those shortcuts if we can because sometimes we don't suffer the consequences in our lifetime so it's very easy to delay it to the next.
Speaker 2
31:27
I was reading some research on gen Z and I think that this is they are really interesting demographic because most of their lives they have been very exposed to. Well if we think about Gen Z people in the west and certainly the West who have been consuming english-language media almost their whole lives. They have been exposed to the Social and environmental impacts of climate change, and they seemed very rightly so very angry and very passionate about trying to do something and many of this demographic in the West on an individual level are trying to do something small and I have to respect that, right? It's so difficult to think what you can do on an individual level. That's really going to move the needle. But I respect the fact that it's more of a. Well we're just going to do it anyway because what else? So I wonder if, yes, we need the nudges from government, yes. We need businesses to just be more accountable and responsible. We need business communities to put pressure on each other to remain accountable to their other stakeholders, or suppliers Within that community. And then maybe we're going to see a sort of demographic, sea change, where you have a wave of consumers who are requiring and holding the businesses that they purchased from to account more in terms of. Yeah. How irresponsible they're being?
Speaker 1
33:04
Yeah, definitely. The generation coming through now, like they really, I would be scared, I would be intimidating if I was a business in these of my consumers because they will be out there, and they will Name and shame you. So they that's amazing but I think one of the challenges is that sustainable consumerism and being sustainable. We have to remember it's a luxury, it's a luxury of the developed world and the majority of consumers that are going to come through in the Next Generation I am not going to be in developed countries are population. Growth is still coming up through India and Africa and so these countries are going to be going through. You know, our industrial revolutions and all these negative things that we did, and that's how we got rich. They're going to be going through that. They're going to go through much quicker than us, and they will come out the other side but it's still going to take time. So even though it's amazing that these kids in these English-speaking countries in these developer starting to have good opinions about what they should do. What's right what's not right globally? The problem still going to exist on a scale of because the majority of people have Going to be, you know, in other countries that are still tackling fundamental human rights issues like just access to education and poverty Meeting those basic needs. Once those basic needs are met, then they can say, oh actually, let us recycle this plastic bottle rather than just throw it away.
Speaker 2
34:31
It's a tricky one. I think that's really, really important point. The one that is easy for us in our Ivory Towers to gloss over a little bit, but.
Speaker 1
34:41
You know, there's as well.
Speaker 2
34:42
Sometimes we have seen it in technological revolutions that emerging economies and people living in emerging economies, they tend to LeapFrog so things. Like, if you look at internet adoption, for example, in many emerging economies it was mobile first. So I wonder if we might see the same when it comes to sort of sustainable business models, because emerging markets around the world are also, the ones that are going to suffer more from Change. So maybe the incentive is more like at their door?
Speaker 1
35:17
Yes, I think. So as well. And I mean there definitely will be leapfrogging because these technological improvements make businesses operate more efficiently as well. So there's an incentive to wanted to operate in that way and you're definitely seeing it. I mean, like you said, mobile phone first in Kenya, they have gone straight to mobile phone banking. So they have something called in pessah, and we don't even do that. Yeah, you can just send money. Me between phones. And so they're really jumping through and I think, you know, China has a really bad rap, and I am not a massive fan for many reasons, and for particular ways in which businesses or governments operate. But one thing that they are doing well is that leapfrogging and in one generation they have gone from being in poverty to? Yeah, you know, being one of the most leading economic country in the world. And when you look at their sdgs and what they're actually the end of the sustainable development goals, they're actually kicking New Zealand's asks in a lot of areas and new zealanders wouldn't want to think that, but I mean figures just don't lie. If you go online and you see what's actually happening because you know those there's a lot more Innovation and progression going on. We're still a little bit and behind the times down here, in New Zealand. So we need to LeapFrog a little bit. I think.
Speaker 2
36:39
What does the future of business? Look like for you?
Speaker 1
36:44
Mmm. Yeah. Okay. Well I am just a massive Optimist. I did this personality test once where I think it says, you know, you're a pathological optimistically much. But again, I love just referring to sit Aesthetics and figures. And, so I think sometimes when we let our emotions and the news and things, you know, we get down rabbit holes of everything. Looking durable and everything on a downward trajectory, but we have to remember the good news doesn't sell. So there's only bad stuff when we look our there. What is the future of business? Sometimes really the vast us. What's going to go on? And then we have that heuristic bias where we see things over and over. So we think that it's happening a lot even though it's probably only very small. So one of my favorite books is a book by a guy called Hans rosling who unfortunately passed away a couple years ago and it's called faithfulness and it's just about how the majority of things in the world are improving the trajectories are up. So that's the thing we are improving, but we can do better.
Speaker 2
37:50
And there's a lot of innovation like I am seeing a lot of innovation in solutions to reduce our dependence on plastic and petrochemicals, there's natural gas and oil. There's a lot of innovation happening in that space. There's Innovation happening in our food systems. There's Innovation happening in our Energy Systems, but we're not yet at the point where we have got scale, and we have got Mass adoption and there's obviously a lot of barriers in front of in the way of that. That. Yeah I am hopeful. I am not entirely sure. We can do it fast enough. Hmm. Yeah I.
Speaker 1
38:26
Like to think I am the optimistic that technocratic optimists are. As we can sort of innovate our way out of things. But again it's yeah the speed at which we can do that but I mean we can do incredible things when we put under pressure and a lot of the biggest innovations that we seen as human species have been through times of extreme The difficulty, like War, which is horrible.
Speaker 2
38:53
And you know, right now.
Speaker 1
38:56
The issues that we're coming up against with the pandemic and poverty and thanks. You know, these are also big issues that I think will push us to innovate.
Speaker 2
39:06
Have you seen any really interesting Innovations recently? Maybe with some of the entrepreneurs you work with.
Speaker 1
39:13
There's a challenge in New Zealand called the Young Enterprise scheme, and it's kids from different schools, and they come together, and they make little businesses, and they pitch them. And to be honest, some of them are little, they go on to actually sell and really do well and have an actual business out of it. But I went to the judging the other day and it was just so inspiring to see that all of them had the business idea. They were presenting it that they had all the core fundamentals that they have Market validation. Station, what was their sales strategy? They have by ended her pre-sales, but they were also talking about the impact that they were going to be having so the environmental or social causes, so I guess not tons and tons of late. Amazing like one particular Innovative idea but it was just nice to see that flowing down into that generation and that is your H coming a real standard to business operations?
Speaker 2
40:07
Yeah. I think that's interesting because clearly they're also thinking of this, from a consumer perspective. Right? When they're building these businesses, they're thinking about what they expect is a consumer and this is there. So I really do think that demographics change is going to bring about real change. But obviously coupled with these are the things we have talked about, like, you know, necessity backs up against the wall, does Foster Innovation and programs in place or government support? That allows Innovation to scale, but yeah, generally hopeful. So look, thank you so much. Much Becky for your time. I really enjoyed looking through the materials that you have put online for us, MBA, students. And I think also making these really accessible, there's a lot of support that you have out there that is for free. And I do think that's a really important message that no matter what your business is, there's always ways to make it create more impact. And one of the really low hanging ways. I suppose in doing that is to find ways to really integrate your business with the community around it. Whether that's the business Community or the community, you serve or the community, you sell to. There's a lot of room to create impact there. So, thank you so much for your time. No worries. It was great. I think you articulated that far better than I ever could. I am like, how to write that down? That sounds great, but it's I think that's the takeaway message and yeah, no, it was absolutely wonderful. I always leave conversations like this one with Becky with hope. She's a pathological Optimist and I guess a little bit of that rubs off but I do really feel that we are at the start of a sea change and this thought really hits me hardest when I am talking to someone from the generation that's coming up behind us. So, that's why it next week I am talking to Belinda and who has just started her career as an ESG consultant, but she's also an activist a podcaster and an organizer. Our of youth-led movements that aim to positively impact social and environmental causes. So if you want to feel hopeful that we're going to get to where we need to get to, then have a listen next week you will hear from me then. Bye.
